Shielding modification - Discussion wanted.

[xThanatoSx]

This is taken from something Tragedy mentioned in one of the other rules debates threads - god only knows which one at this point

As we all know (or should know by this point ), the shielding rule specifically states that a shoulder hit zone must be visible to your opponent, unless the blocking object is closer to the opponent than you.

Traj made some offhand comment about specifically adding the phrase "... or their chest hit zone..." to the rule as that is now an actual hit zone.

Over the last 6 weeks playing in Sacramento I've come to the conclusion personally that while the fronts of the guns still give me fits at times, the chests definitely don't.

Now, I realize that adding this would mean some window shots that have long been illegal would suddenly become usable. Hence wanting discussion from as many people as possible, old school and new school. I'm sure there are implications I haven't thought of yet, but that's why I put it out to the community.

13(c) A player may not block, with any part of their body, clothing, or equipment, nor use any other player, referee, or any part of the playing arena to block all of their shoulder hit zones from an opponent whom they are targeting with their phaser, unless the blocking object is closer to the opponent than it is to the player themselves. (Should a player have both shoulder hit zones blocked from an opponents view by different objects, both blocking objects must be closer to the opponent otherwise the player will be in breach of part (c))

3(c) A player may not block, with any part of their body, clothing, or equipment, nor use any other player, referee, or any part of the playing arena to block all of their visible hit zones from an opponent whom they are targeting with their phaser, unless the blocking object is closer to the opponent than it is to the player themselves. (Should a player have all visible hit zones blocked from an opponents view by different objects, all blocking objects must be closer to the opponent otherwise the player will be in breach of part (c)) A Visible Hit Zone is defined in the Glossary.

Visible Hit Zone: A visible hit zone is defined as a hit zone that also incorporates visible, flashing lights. (The forward facing IR from the phaser is excluded from this definition).

When you are pointing your phaser at an opponent, you must have at least either one shoulder hit zone OR your chest hit zone visible to the opponent you are targeting. If you are trying for a shot where your opponents infra-red is reflecting off an object (eg a wall), then you do not have to be able to see each other. However, what is blocking your view of your opponent, or your opponents view of you, must be closer to your opponent than it is to you. You can have your chest hit zone and both of your shoulder hit zones blocked by different things. If any of these objects are closer to you, then you may not target your opponent until this situation is rectified.

*admin edit - copied Traj's proposal as I think that basically covers it.

[xDKx]

I can't imagine too many situation where you'd have the chest visible but not a shoulder, but for G6 and any future hardware that has a chest sensor, I agree that the chest sensor should be counted a visible hit zone, so long as the IR is always "visible" in concert with the lights (as it is with the shoulders, but not necessarily with the guns).

[Scorpion]

3(c) A player may not block, with any part of their body, clothing, or equipment, nor use any other player, referee, or any part of the playing arena to block all of their shoulder and chest hit zones from an opponent whom they are targeting with their phaser, unless the blocking object is closer to the opponent than it is to the player themselves. (Should a player have all shoulder and chest hit zones blocked from an opponents view by different objects, all blocking objects must be closer to the opponent otherwise the player will be in breach of part (c))

[Scorpion]

More rewording will be necessary. The proposed wording makes some currently legal shots into illegal shots, and I don't think that is desirable. See if you can figure out what the problem is.

[xThanatoSx]

No - I definitely don't want to turn anything currently legal into something illegal.

I just want to add to the legal.

[Dazzalo]

More rewording will be necessary. The proposed wording makes some currently legal shots into illegal shots, and I don't think that is desirable. See if you can figure out what the problem is.

Hmm..

Should a player have all shoulder and chest hit zones blocked from an opponents view by different objects, all blocking objects must be closer to the opponent otherwise the player will be in breach of part (c))

So any player who plays with their phaser in front of their chest, will be constantly in breach of this rule..?

Perhaps the rule could be left as is, and have the chest excluded like the phaser. That way everyone will be showing a shoulder, and the game virtually stays as is. Players will still have the extra option of targeting the chest, but the shoulder is likely to be visible first anyway.

[xThanatoSx]

Hm. I see your point there Dazz.

Which is not what I'm trying to go for at all.

I want the rule to read something to the effect of a player must have either a shoulder OR their chest sensor visible to their opponent in order to take a legal shot - as long as one of those 3 sensors is visible, no worries.

[tragedy]

I think I can see Dazz's interpretation. It's a stretch but it's there

3(c) A player may not block, with any part of their body, clothing, or equipment, nor use any other player, referee, or any part of the playing arena to block all of their visible hit zones from an opponent whom they are targeting with their phaser, unless the blocking object is closer to the opponent than it is to the player themselves. (Should a player have all visible hit zones blocked from an opponents view by different objects, all blocking objects must be closer to the opponent otherwise the player will be in breach of part (c)) A Visible Hit Zone is defined in the Glossary.

Visible Hit Zone: A visible hit zone is defined as a hit zone that also incorporates visible, flashing lights. (The forward facing IR from the phaser is excluded from this definition).

When you are pointing your phaser at an opponent, you must have at least either one shoulder hit zone OR your chest hit zone visible to the opponent you are targeting. If you are trying for a shot where your opponents infra-red is reflecting off an object (eg a wall), then you do not have to be able to see each other. However, what is blocking your view of your opponent, or your opponents view of you, must be closer to your opponent than it is to you. You can have your chest hit zone and both of your shoulder hit zones blocked by different things. If any of these objects are closer to you, then you may not target your opponent until this situation is rectified.

[tragedy]

Scorpion has highlighted a problem with the above definitions in that if a player was, for example, at a higher elevation in front of a low wall or railing that covered his chest and between him and his target was a beam that blocked his opponent's view of his shoulders then the player is in breach. Even though it is really no fault of his. He can't help the rail being where it is and could quite easily not be able to tell that the beam is blocking his shoulders. (I can name at least one place in Brisbane where this happens fairly regularly).

He suggests dropping the part of the rule that states that all blocking objects must be closer (which takes the rule back to it's original form plus chest).

I suggest something along the lines of any blocking objects beyond two metres of the person targetting cannot be included as it is (more often than not) too difficult to judge that your shoulders are not visible to your opponent.

Ideas and suggestions. We cannot go forward and finalise Shielding (c) with chest emitters until we get it right.

[Shadow Dagger]

Scorpion has highlighted a problem with the above definitions in that if a player was, for example, at a higher elevation in front of a low wall or railing that covered his chest and between him and his target was a beam that blocked his opponent's view of his shoulders then the player is in breach. Even though it is really no fault of his. He can't help the rail being where it is and could quite easily not be able to tell that the beam is blocking his shoulders. (I can name at least one place in Brisbane where this happens fairly regularly).

He suggests dropping the part of the rule that states that all blocking objects must be closer (which takes the rule back to it's original form plus chest).

Ditto, with Scorpion's option...

*The simpler the better...*

Plus, doesn't the Glossary definition of Visible Hit Zones already cover the Chest Sensor Area? Or is my interpretation off for some reason?...

[Spoonman]

I can't imagine too many situation where you'd have the chest visible but not a shoulder

Just wait until you see Brisbane one day.

Really.

It's insane.

[mEoW!]

Just wait until you see Brisbane one day.

Really.

It's insane.

yah its goooood....

[Spoonman]

I'll reserve judgement on that (given that the Brisbane maze is the ULTIMATE antithesis to the Oakleigh maze), but since the main controlling area of the maze is the bridge, which features at least 6-7 windows which cover both shoulders but are 'tall' enough to allow someone to sight down the barrel + show the chest sensor at the same time.. seems like a good rule for that maze to me! Otherwise we'd have run out of refs real fast